Thursday, July 14, 2005

The Rove Circus and Knowledge as "Not Forgetting"

I name this catagory "What the Sophists Would Have You Forget."

Here at the Underground Logician, I'm ever commited to your knowledge so you are not hoodwinked by the Sophists. Specifically for today, I've included past articles and quotes regarding information that is applicable to "Rove-gate" of which those who wish to attack President Bush via Karl Rove wish you not know or remember. Again, here is yet another example of how knowledge is "not forgetting."

NOC, NOC, Who's There?

Fred Rustmann, a former CIA official who put in 24 years as a spymaster and was Plame's boss for a few years, says Plame worked under official cover in Europe in the early 1990s — say, as a U.S. embassy attache — before switching to nonofficial cover a few years later. Mostly Plame posed as a business analyst or a student in what Rustmann describes as a "nice European city." Plame was never a so-called deep-cover NOC, he said, meaning the agency did not create a complex cover story about her education, background, job, personal life and even hobbies and habits that would stand up to intense scrutiny by foreign governments. "[NOCs] are on corporate rolls, and if anybody calls the corporation, the secretary says, 'Yeah, he works for us,'" says Rustmann. "The degree of backstopping to a NOC's cover is a very good indication of how deep that cover really is."

USA Today: CIA Outing May Not Be A Crime

"The column's date is important because the law against unmasking the identities of U.S. spies says a "covert agent" must have been on an overseas assignment "within the last five years." The assignment also must be long-term, not a short trip or temporary post, two experts on the law say. Wilson's book makes numerous references to the couple's life in Washington over the six years up to July 2003. "

William Safire: The Jailing of Judith Miller

"Evidently no such serious crime took place. After spending two years and thousands of F.B.I. agent-hours and millions of dollars that could better have been directed against terrorism and identity theft, the prosecutor, Patrick Fitzgerald, admits his investigation has been stalled since last October. We have seen no indictment under the identities protection act."

So, if Valerie Plame was NOT a covert CIA operative, and "outing" said operative does not fall within the 1982 Intelligence Identities Protection Act, and no crime has been committed by Judith Miller, then why the media frenzy surrounding Karl Rove?

It's obvious, isn't it?

Next on what the sophists would have you forget: what has been reported on Joe Wilson's Niger Report flip-flop. What did you "not forget?"


At 4:17 PM, Blogger Saur♥Kraut said...

You know, I just heard this covered this morning on a radio talk show. And I found it very eye-opening because (frankly) I was very opposed to Rove and what he did. (I do still question if what he did was done out of some malice, however...whether it was legal or not).

What I understood is that Rove was saying that her husband was not highly qualified to be a weapons inspector but he had gone at the request of his wife, not the Bush administration. And that was the purpose behind the explanation.

At 4:33 PM, Blogger Underground Logician said...

I think the malice is in Wilson himself toward the Bush administration. I'm looking to see what the Senate intelligence commitee report has on this to see what Wilson had reported and then compare this to his later story. More to come.

At 4:44 PM, Blogger Saur♥Kraut said...

An interesting thought...

At 12:00 PM, Blogger greatwhitebear said...

a) Plame had a European assignment as recent as a year before her outing

b) Rove is just a secondary player, the guy who confirmed what someone else had aready told Novak.

c) Wilson did not go at the request of his wife. When the CIA was looking for someone qualified to investigate the yellowcake allegations, she suggested him to the person in charge, who agreed he was qualified to do the job.

d) The overwhelming evidence is that Wilson was indeed correct in his assesment, so apparently he was pretty qualified.

e) Rove should fired because Dubya promised to fire ANYONE involved in Plames outing. He clearly was, and lied about it. Or else Scott McLellan is the biggest liar since Nixon. And frankly, McLellan has the look of somebody who has been blind sided by Dick Butkus. So I doubt the latter to be true.

At 1:42 PM, Blogger Underground Logician said...

The law was not broken. Not with Judith Miller, not with Karl Rove. It doesn't fit the criteria spelled out in the Intellegence Identities Protection Act of 1982.

Your personal dislike of Rove and McClellan and your comments on McClellan's looks speaks a lot about you personally, but not to the issue at hand.

Bush has no need to fire Rove, since Rove didn't break the law. The "meme" you stated, "anyone who was involved in the Plame outing" has been crafted by the left. It gets repeated over and over until no one actually remembers what is actually said. Bush said he would fire anyone who broke the law. Ah, the differences "nuances" make.

At 6:24 PM, Blogger greatwhitebear said...

a) Bush said he would "fire anyone involved", direct quote.

b) my comment was not on McLellan's personal appearance, it was on his demeanor. And it was sympathetic to him. I think he is in the toughest position imaginable, defending the actions of somebody who lied directly to him and made him look foolish. I feel sorry for him.

c) According to the CIA, Plame was working at a CIA front company in Virginia. She had traveled to Paris less than a year earlier on "business". Her outing has compromised possibly hundreds of people, some of whom may now risk bodily harm or death. Whether or not Rove's actions were illegal, the are morally reprehensable and border on treason. More than enough reason fire Karl's ass. And any American who is not appalled, no matter what their political convictions, should take a deep look inside themselves.

There comes a time when national security and the rule of law become more important than party politics. Nixon was forced to resign because a lot of good Republicans like Goldwater were as disgusted by him as any democrat. The whole Plame affair should disgust EVERYONE who is a good patriotic American.

At 12:10 AM, Blogger Underground Logician said...

Did Judith Miller then become a party in breaking the law? The New York Times and Washington Post don't think so.

I guess I'm more appalled at the vitriol that is spewing from the Left. Talk about a verbal eco-disaster! Yes, let's bring up Nixon, for this is what the entire kerfuffle is all about, getting to Bush to get him to resign. Yup, no smoke generated by the Left can conceal that objective.

At 1:53 PM, Blogger Isabella di Pesto said...

UL said:

"I guess I'm more appalled at the vitriol that is spewing from the Left."

You're appalled at the vitriol? Really? You're not appalled that someone committed an act of treason and outed a CIA agent?


Listen, UL. The CIA called for this criminal investigation. Criminal. Get it?

Not the Democrats. The CIA. You don't get the Executive Branch, and the CIA to open a CRIMINAL INVESTIGATION over a partisan smear.

Someone in Bush's administration is guilty of a high crime.

We all know now that Karl Rove lied.

I personally am not surprised that a political dirty trickster lied and encouraged a vendetta against a former Ambassador and a CIA agent.

I am surprised though, that the dirty trickster Rove is considered Bush's Brain, and that Bush is okay with that--hat someone so dispicable is so close to the man who proclaimed he would bring back integrity and honesty to the WH.


We are all wearing the blue dress now.

At 11:03 PM, Blogger Underground Logician said...

What do you me "we?" By the way, you have made my point. Thank you.

At 8:53 AM, Blogger Isabella di Pesto said...

What point is that?

At 10:21 AM, Blogger Underground Logician said...

You're the one quoting me. You figure it out.


Post a Comment

<< Home